Comments on: If you can’t stand the Heath, get out of the kitchen cabinet http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/ crass, boorish and more a bruiser than blogger Fri, 25 Jul 2008 01:37:22 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.1 By: Clegg disaster http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-165759 Clegg disaster Mon, 25 Feb 2008 23:44:07 +0000 http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-165759 This isn't meant to wind you up, but why is Clegg defending the Speaker calling criticism a withc-hunt. Clegg's making a disastrous leader. This isn’t meant to wind you up, but why is Clegg defending the Speaker calling criticism a withc-hunt. Clegg’s making a disastrous leader.

]]> By: Cov http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-164508 Cov Mon, 18 Feb 2008 10:03:08 +0000 http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-164508 'Iwantareferendum' is run and funded by the same people who brought us the 'No' Campaign and before that 'Business for Sterling'. They have used the same messages i.e. pro-EU but opposed to the euro/constitution/Lisbon Treaty, and the same tactics e.g. highlight dissenting Labour and Liberal Democrat MPs to create the impression of division in the parties and apply pressure to pro-Europeans in marginal constituencies. They are certainly front groups. But it is far too simple to describe them as a cover for the Tories (despite the many years I spent at BiE doing so). They are not. When it comes to Europe the normal rules have never applied. Instead these groups are merely a front for those who believe that Britain should leave the EU. Nothing more, nothing less. It just happens to be that there are lots of Tories who support this and the Party itself are currently the biggest electoral beneficiaries from the, mostly superficial, anti-European sentiment in the UK. ‘Iwantareferendum’ is run and funded by the same people who brought us the ‘No’ Campaign and before that ‘Business for Sterling’.

They have used the same messages i.e. pro-EU but opposed to the euro/constitution/Lisbon Treaty, and the same tactics e.g. highlight dissenting Labour and Liberal Democrat MPs to create the impression of division in the parties and apply pressure to pro-Europeans in marginal constituencies.

They are certainly front groups. But it is far too simple to describe them as a cover for the Tories (despite the many years I spent at BiE doing so). They are not. When it comes to Europe the normal rules have never applied. Instead these groups are merely a front for those who believe that Britain should leave the EU. Nothing more, nothing less. It just happens to be that there are lots of Tories who support this and the Party itself are currently the biggest electoral beneficiaries from the, mostly superficial, anti-European sentiment in the UK.

]]> By: James Graham http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-164389 James Graham Sun, 17 Feb 2008 20:25:22 +0000 http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-164389 newmania - I don't recall calling for anything to be banned (Why is it that whenever you highlight something people assume you are trying to ban it? What does it say about their instincts I wonder?), just for people to be aware of the links. Iwantareferendum is particularly interesting because it is clearly bankrolled to the hilt. All I'm saying is that it is soft money. <em>better 800,000 voters on the margin than two or three deal making courtiers at several removes from anyone at all , your option.</em> Actually, it's potentially 8,000 voters who could make the difference, although obviously you'd have to target more than that. As for "two or three deal making courtiers" - meaning PR - what planet are you on? Governance in this country has been stitched up in smoke filled rooms for centuries - FPTP does that. PR on the other hand brings all that out in the open, often bloodily (see Wales 9 months ago for instance). But of course you know all that and are just trying to bamboozle people. Plus ca change. newmania - I don’t recall calling for anything to be banned (Why is it that whenever you highlight something people assume you are trying to ban it? What does it say about their instincts I wonder?), just for people to be aware of the links. Iwantareferendum is particularly interesting because it is clearly bankrolled to the hilt. All I’m saying is that it is soft money.

better 800,000 voters on the margin than two or three deal making courtiers at several removes from anyone at all , your option.

Actually, it’s potentially 8,000 voters who could make the difference, although obviously you’d have to target more than that. As for “two or three deal making courtiers” - meaning PR - what planet are you on? Governance in this country has been stitched up in smoke filled rooms for centuries - FPTP does that. PR on the other hand brings all that out in the open, often bloodily (see Wales 9 months ago for instance).

But of course you know all that and are just trying to bamboozle people. Plus ca change.

]]> By: john Dixon http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-164361 john Dixon Sun, 17 Feb 2008 16:22:26 +0000 http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-164361 It's sad that the top people think we need to be 'tough', its a misconception of why the party wont vote for us rather than anything else and its one which will probably end up losing more votes than anything else. It’s sad that the top people think we need to be ‘tough’, its a misconception of why the party wont vote for us rather than anything else and its one which will probably end up losing more votes than anything else.

]]> By: newmania http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-164320 newmania Sun, 17 Feb 2008 11:16:57 +0000 http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-164320 I `m not sure what you are saying about 'I want a referendum 'or the hunting lobby . Are you saying that if the Conservative constituency largely agree with a particular view point then any campaigning for it should be banned ?...On the electoral system the usual specious clap trap , better 800,000 voters on the margin than two or three deal making courtiers at several removes from anyone at all , your option. I am not at all sre that the hunting lobby actually does much good for the Conservative Party’s need for swing voters as these are all Conservatives anyway. The referendum point is stew of your own making . If you were not such utter liars then you would not be in this fix and accepting disagreement of this sort is not grown up it is a farce and a n imposture fro any organisation which pretends to be a political Party and not just a franchise for nutty protests of any incoherent sort whatsoever . I `m not sure what you are saying about ‘I want a referendum ‘or the hunting lobby . Are you saying that if the Conservative constituency largely agree with a particular view point then any campaigning for it should be banned ?…On the electoral system the usual specious clap trap , better 800,000 voters on the margin than two or three deal making courtiers at several removes from anyone at all , your option.

I am not at all sre that the hunting lobby actually does much good for the Conservative Party’s need for swing voters as these are all Conservatives anyway. The referendum point is stew of your own making . If you were not such utter liars then you would not be in this fix and accepting disagreement of this sort is not grown up it is a farce and a n imposture fro any organisation which pretends to be a political Party and not just a franchise for nutty protests of any incoherent sort whatsoever .

]]> By: Tim http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-164305 Tim Sun, 17 Feb 2008 09:17:42 +0000 http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-164305 The really annoying thing about this is that Mike Hancock is one of the major backers, giving legitimacy to this so called 'cross bench' campaign. In Somerton and Frome, the press releases from iwantareferendum include quotes from David Heath's tory opponent attacking him. How the hell is Hancock getting such a free ride essentially targeting Huhne, Heath etc for Tory gain? The really annoying thing about this is that Mike Hancock is one of the major backers, giving legitimacy to this so called ‘cross bench’ campaign. In Somerton and Frome, the press releases from iwantareferendum include quotes from David Heath’s tory opponent attacking him. How the hell is Hancock getting such a free ride essentially targeting Huhne, Heath etc for Tory gain?

]]> By: Linda Jack http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-164201 Linda Jack Sat, 16 Feb 2008 19:14:46 +0000 http://www.theliberati.net/quaequamblog/2008/02/16/if-you-cant-stand-the-heath-get-out-of-the-kitchen-cabinet/#comment-164201 You are right Mr G. Although I have to admit, I have never come across the word obscurationist before, so I feel well educated by your post too! l :-) You are right Mr G. Although I have to admit, I have never come across the word obscurationist before, so I feel well educated by your post too!

l
:-)

]]>